David 0:00

Since COVID, we've learned the importance of employee assistance plans, but one size doesn't fit all. What sizes are available? And what do you need to know to fit your clients appropriately? We'll find out on this episode of Shift Shapers.

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Change either paralyzes or energizes. The choice is yours. You're listening to the Shift Shapers podcast. You're about to learn firsthand from businesses and entrepreneurs who have successfully shaped the shifts in their industries. Get ready to become the change you want to see. This episode is brought to you by Shift Shaper Strategies. In sales, if you confuse, you lose. Clarify your message so you win more clients, crush your sales goals, and build your practice. Learn more at ShiftShaperStrategies.com. And now here's your host, Storybrand Certified Guide and Chief Transformation Strategist at Shift Shaper Strategies, David Saltzman.

David 1:08

The last two years have clearly illustrated the importance of EAPs. If you didn't think EAPs were important before, whether you're an employer or an employee, you now know how important those are. But what we've also learned is that one size doesn't fit all, and there's all kinds of different ways to create these so that they're both valuable for employers and of value to employees. And so we've asked John Troutman, who's the National Director of Marketing at Mazzetti and Sullivan EAP, to join us. And to talk about kind of the state of the art and what's going on with EAPs and how they're evolving. Welcome, John.

SPEAKER_02 1:48

David, thank you so much for having me. It's an honor to be here.

David 1:51

Thank you. As I said in the open, the term EAP is kind of a wide brush term. Can you help us define a good generic definition of an EAP?

SPEAKER_02 2:00

Yeah, employee assistance programs. So there is a very wide brush. They can be typically embedded into a life insurance policy or another plan. Oftentimes they can be embedded in your health insurance, but they can be very wide-ranging to a platform that just covers the employee to something that may cover the entire household and offer other services like trainings and other valuable tools. So that's a it's a great span of options, what you can do with EAPs today.

David 2:30

So let's try to level set market-wise. There have been some EAPs that have gotten a bad rep over time. Why is that? Because it seems like they're supremely useful. What happened there?

SPEAKER_02 2:42

Well, again, what oftentimes can happen is with an EAP program, especially if it's embedded, it may be buried, if you will, so deep into a plan that people don't even know it's there. The utilization rate of those type of programs are oftentimes less than 3%. Typically, those embedded plans that I've seen are actually oftentimes 1% or less. So having a standalone plan gets much more visibility and can allow that entire group to be aware. Oftentimes those standalone plans will often come with a direct client solution specialist that will work with that HR team and really drive utilization. So one of those things that's established a bad rap is just no utilization. I mean, who wants to buy a product or service that they know in advance is going to get less than 5% utilization? Or that that provider may cancel the contract if it gets above 5%. And that's a big part of the bad rap that's out there, even existing today.

David 3:40

With the EAPs that are built into plans, was it an access problem or just an awareness problem or a combination of both?

SPEAKER_02 3:47

Yeah, and again, this has been going on for years, and I can't speak to you know the longevity and the past necessarily. I just know from talking to advisors around the country, I have many great relationships with brokers across the country. And oftentimes it's a case where it just gets buried. They're so busy and other in so many things in the presentations. When they're meeting in uh in front of that entire employee group to go over benefits, you know, mental health has traditionally taken a back seat. Whether it's a great program or whether it's a very weak program, many times it takes the back seat. And, you know, neglect, no matter where it is in business or life, you know, that's going to show up down the road. And I think that's led to where we are today. Granted, awareness is much better today than it has been in the past. And I don't think we have the stigma like we used to have, but that challenge is still there to get it used because advisors are so busy and all those other things that are paying them to sell into market, they're not really getting something financially out of that EAP plan.

David 4:48

How much of a catalyst would you say the pandemic has been to EAP take up and utilization?

SPEAKER_02 4:53

You know, it's very interesting, David. Uh, if I may speak of our own experience of what we saw, I can speak to that exact data. It was very interesting when COVID started. There was a drastic drop in utilization. And I believe that was because parents were now home, their kids were home, everybody was in that house. And who wants to talk about life challenges when your kids may be in the same room or just on the other side of the wall? So now that was a period of about three weeks, and then utilization just skyrocketed. So I believe awareness went up drastically. Everybody was sort of trapped in their own home, a prisoner in their own kingdom, if you will. So they would begin looking for options and ways out and other resources, and EAPs were there across the country.

David 5:35

So if you're looking for a well-constructed EAP, what's the range of services that you should be looking for?

SPEAKER_02 5:42

Well, I believe one of the things you need to find in an EAP is am I going to get a dedicated person assigned to this account? Having one point of contact. I mean, that goes without saying. We all understand, I would hope, the value of business relationships. People buy from people and you will buy in to that one person. Oftentimes, that person, whatever their title may be, we refer to them as client solutions specialists. Oftentimes that person's job is to uncover other areas of need, whether it be an HR or some other area, to help support them through those existing services in the EAP plan, not just go over the employees' benefit, but also looking for other solutions to help them as well. So if I was an employer, I would want to make sure I have a dedicated person assigned to that account. That's one of the most important things, I believe.

David 6:33

So these provisions are based on relationships. Do the relationships endure? If I'm a patient, for example, I'm a member of a plan and I call in, do I am I able to build a relationship with the same person over a longitudinal study? Or is it just something that I get whoever happens to answer the phone and they look up my records on a computer screen?

SPEAKER_02 6:52

Yeah, that's a great question because again, every EAP is different. You may be be a part of an EAP plan where you're actually going to call in and talk to a clinician. In other cases, you may be calling into a call center. In other cases, you may be calling in and leaving a voice message. So to clarify, if you're calling in, many times you may get the be able to work with the exact same counselor or clinician. Now, again, we're talking about a wide range of support here. So some EAP programs, it's a life coach. They may or may not have professional certification or licenses. If I may speak of our services, we do have everyone is a master level clinician. So it pays to know who that support team is. Another key point is not just knowing that person and sticking with that same coach because who wants to start up with a different person on your second covered session or your third covered session, right? So, but how skilled is this person? How do they have the experience as well as the license? But what is the time frame? So a lot of EAP programs are 30 minutes, some are 45, others are an hour. So understand if I'm an employer, I want to know what I'm paying for as well as the time frame because there's a big difference of what you can cover between 30 minutes and an hour.

David 8:03

So if I'm an employer and I'm looking at different EAPs, what type of people do I want to look for who are answering those phones? And how do I know that an employee who's beyond the grasp of help of a clinician needs to be referred someplace else? How does how can I assure myself that that will happen?

SPEAKER_02 8:21

Yeah, again, that's the value of working with an EAP provider that's going to be driven to build a business relationship, not just be a service provider, right? So working with that EAP program that's going to really work at understanding what are the challenges that are going on and can actually drive utilization, but also awareness and what are best next steps. Some EAP programs that are out there, like ours, support the entire HR team with free consultations. So you can contact that office literally every day for no additional fee. If I was an employer, I would look for that type of provider because I know it's not just the employees that are struggling, those struggling employees will go to their supervisor. They'll go to the HR and they're gonna vent in some capacity there, or it's gonna go secondhand back to HR, and then HR is gonna have to deal with that. HR doesn't want to deal with EAP style challenges. They would love to refer them to the EAP provider and actually directly communicate with that EAP provider to find those solutions and get the better results. So it's a lot of hand holding, but that's what I would look for as an employer is what type of EAP program out there is robust enough that's going to support my leadership, not just the employees.

David 9:33

But if I'm an employee and I call in, let me go to a uh the next level, I guess. Sure. If I'm an employee and call in and I'm talking to somebody who's an MSW, and what I really need is a psychiatrist, or what I really need is a different level of therapy, should I ask my EAP provider how they triage those people who call in and how they determine what level of care and how they pass that off?

SPEAKER_02 9:53

Yes, yes. That's a question you need to ask. And again, yeah, every EA plan, EAP plan is different. So understanding what you get in those benefits, understanding how what that looks like if you need that long-term care. And let me clarify: EAPs were never set up to be a long-term solution to a person's mental health need. They're meant to be something ideally on the front end, a preventative measure, just like a wellness plan, for example. So it's they're not really designed to be exclusively reactionary. However, they can be. They really can be. So, but understand, communicate with your EAP, understand what's involved if a person needs a lot more intense care. I mean, there's a lot of disorders that are out there that four sessions or five sessions aren't going to cover and meet that person's need. So a lot of EAP programs out there work directly with the carrier and will align that counselor up so that if those sessions need to continue beyond those covered number sessions, you can stay with that person and it will go to their health insurance plan.

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David 11:53

Oftentimes a person's problems are all bound up in the family unit, and they're all of those complicating factors. Do most EAPs offer family coverage or are they all different? Some of them are employee only, some are family with a buy-up. How what are you seeing in the marketplace?

SPEAKER_02 12:08

Yeah, so again, a wide range of coverage. Some of the plans that are out there cover the employee only, some cover the covered dependents, some cover those who are family members, and then others cover the entire household, whether or not you're related. So understanding what you're getting in that benefit is very valuable because, as we are all understand, I mean, those challenges that you have in your home are going to carry over to your job. They're going to carry over the rest of your life. So if people are dealing with a challenge in your home and they can get that support, certainly it's a great opportunity for them to get that help, but also it'll help ease that stress that you have as a parent, knowing that your child or wanting you knowing that your loved one is getting the help that they need.

David 12:50

You know, again, we'll go back to the pandemic. Ever since this the goofy quarantine started, I guess the question is, what are like the top three or four things that that your people are hearing? What are the stressors that you're mainly dealing with so that you know employers can be aware of that as well?

SPEAKER_02 13:04

Yeah, I mean, it's there's always gonna be the challenges of relationships, right? Whether that be parents with their kids with all that's going on with schools and COVID and the changing, you know, their their home, they're going back to school. So relationships are always gonna be a big one up there in why they're calling or using the EAP service. Managing stress. Now that could be work-life balance issue, that could be anything, but managing stress and understanding how to better manage that is always gonna be a big one. It's been huge. People who normally don't get you know anxiety attacks or contacting us, reaching out. Burnout right now, David, is I don't want to say it a record high. You know, we really don't know those numbers, but I believe it's something that's going to continue with all that's going on in our world. So people are pushing themselves or doing a little bit too much, they're doing it, extending themselves or overextending themselves, and quite frankly, not giving themselves that self-care that they need. You know, it's one thing to go to the gym, that that's something, it's a physical place. We can we can understand that the weights that we need, we can understand the diet, we can understand a little bit of a better diet and maybe even weight loss if we need it. But understanding our mental health, understanding the value of a pause and taking a break, taking time for that self-care mentally is something that really translates over to burnout. And I believe you know that's just a one that's uh on the rise, and I believe we haven't seen, you know, the worst of that yet.

David 14:24

Interesting. Now, traditionally EAPs have been telephonic. Are there new technologies being used? Is these video being used, two other tools that come into play, whether it's initially or monitoring or whatever? What are you guys seeing in that realm?

SPEAKER_02 14:37

Yeah, so again, understanding if you're looking for a program, understand what you're going to get. A lot of them today are telephonic or even a virtual platform, so you can talk to someone, you know, like we are here today. Others are still, you know, invested in brick and mortar locations. And I'm a firm believer in the opportunity of going to a physical location to talk to somebody. You know, we are so accustomed to this, talking in this, and communication is so much more than the box around my head. You know, understanding body language and seeing that somebody cares by how they're sitting in front of you and having the comfort of a person's counseling office to just be relaxed. You know, there's enough barriers out there to go and get the mental help that you need and mental health, adding that challenge of being limited by technology, I'll say, it just is tremendously valuable. You know, if if you're working around your home and there's an accident that takes place, I mean, I'm not going to call, you know, Teledoc. I'm going to go, I want to go to an ER if I cut myself with a chainsaw. So that benefit of just knowing that there could be a location within 15 minutes of your home to talk to a clinician can go a long way to ease stress.

David 15:46

Is that something that some EAPs are starting to offer? Is physical locations and a wide network of physical locations?

SPEAKER_02 15:54

Okay, correct. So, I mean, for example, we cover, you know, all of our clients nationwide with coverage that there's a clinician within a dreet a reasonable driving distance of that employer's corporate office. So we are not the only ones that provide that, but as you know, as many people know, a lot of people double down on the virtual platform, which is great, right? That opportunity to talk to someone is a huge benefit, but it's also beneficial to know, you know, that you can physically go to a place and you can be there for that time frame, whatever that EAP plan is includes. You know, you can be, I believe, a lot of people prefer that face-to-face option even during COVID.

David 16:30

You know, that's interesting because I I have a couple of friends, one in the Atlanta area and one up in New England, who, especially with the advent of the opioid crisis, they spent months, literally months, trying to find a clinician to talk to. So having an EAP that gives a uh a network, is is there a guarantee that that I'll actually be able to see somebody in that network in that kind of a setting?

SPEAKER_02 16:54

Those providers out there that that do include those face-to-face options, for example, ours is scalable, so we will work with that group and in due time, depending on that size of the group. You know, if you're talking about an employee group of 10,000 employees, that's going to be a little more challenging to get the appropriate number of clinicians, of course. So just understanding, you know, it may take a little bit of time, a little bit of time, meaning a week, you know, maybe two weeks, depending on that size of that employee group. But those providers that provide face-to-face locations, they will make that scalable and work with that employer to see that they have that option as well.

David 17:29

Is that also a hybrid platform? So if I can't see somebody for a couple of weeks, but my problem is today, do I have the option of being able to talk to somebody telephonically or as we're talking, you know, video chat?

SPEAKER_02 17:40

Yeah. Again, if I was an employer, I would look for a robust plan and I would ask that EAP provider right out of the gate, do you offer robust plans, you know, and understand what that means? That's a big part of it. So our clients have that option. Other robust plans that are out there have that option. They can know it doesn't have to be face-to-face. It could be, you know, we're going to schedule something two weeks from now with that clinician, but right now that same clinician we're going to talk to on a virtual platform or over the phone. So it can be a little bit of a hybrid, a little bit of a mix. But again, just that value of knowing you could actually go to a place and just relax, right? I mean, there's so much tension out there in the world, and being able just to just to be yourself in a place can really go a long way to address those issues. You know, many times it isn't even that issue that they're going to talk to the clinician about. It's something else that was buried. It just happened to be that one issue, you know, that broke the camel's back, if you will, that got them to go and get the help they need. And it's a good thing they got the help, but there could be other underlying issues that need to be addressed. And it was just that one item that got them to that point.

David 18:42

What's still missing and what is coming?

SPEAKER_02 18:45

Well, I think what is missing is across the board is that opportunity to really drive utilization. It shouldn't be okay. And again, I may be stepping on some advisor toes here today, but mental health should never be a checkbox. Mental health is a crucial part of everyone's well-being and should never simply be if it's on a piece of paper, we're going to check it off and move on to something else. It should never be the very last thing because our mental health affects everything else that we do. So what's lacking is the passion across the country to address mental health on an equal platform. It shouldn't always be the last five minutes of an open enrollment session, of that time of meeting with the employees. It really should not be. It should be given equal time and opportunity to be explained so that the employees understand the benefit. That's why utilization is so low, is because it's not given that same weight and that same importance. There has to be a point in time down the road, David, where it's not going to be another just checkbox. We're going to do our due diligence, we're going to understand the benefit. If it's even going to be helpful to this employer group, are they going to get the utilization they need to their success? So that's a big part of it, I believe, in awareness and understanding. And that comes down to the individual, whoever that broker or advisor may be.

David 20:02

John, do you think that with the pandemic, you know, raising the heat on mental health issues? And as you say, you know, this burnout problem, which you and I and a lot of other practitioners know is just starting to come, do you think that will move mental health up on the agenda for these open enrollment meetings and make it more prominent?

SPEAKER_02 20:20

Well, here's what I've seen, David, from my own experience. I've seen a lot of people talking about it. They're talking about it. But my question is, what are they doing about it? Because I don't see a lot of action from people, from some people who are doing a lot of the talking, in all due respect. And when we put that action, we put those words and those concepts out there that we're talking about, whether it be on LinkedIn or other platforms, when we put those words out there into action, we start making changes and we start changing the priority of things, that's where we're going to see the change. That's where we're going to see the emphasis. And that's we're going to see the prevention for a lot of these mental health conditions. A lot of these things are preventable things, right? And when we take time for ourselves as an individual, you know, it's not being selfish, taking a pause. It's not being selfish, taking a 10-minute break out of every day and just taking some personal reflection, professional reflection about things if you're feeling stressed out. 10 minutes. You know, the data says that 10-minute break, putting aside your phone, giving yourself just that 10 minutes means I could be 87% more productive. I think that would be worth my while from a production standpoint alone, not to mention the stress. So, you know, being able to put action to the words and be leaders in the change. And when the leaders come out and say we're not going to be okay anymore with just a checkbox, we're going to prioritize this and give it the same weight as everything else. That's when we're going to see the change, as opposed to what I believe is still a lot of words.

David 21:46

John, as the EAP industry grows out, and we hope you'll come back and share some more with us, John Troutman, National Director of Marketing at Mazetti and Sullivan EAP. John, thanks so much for your wisdom today.

SPEAKER_02 21:57

Well, David, thank you so much for having me. It's a great privilege to be with you.

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